Jew World Order

ELEANOR HALL: The Federal Government and the Coalition are trading accusations today over if and when either side had any indication before Saturday that Qantas management was about to escalate its industrial dispute.

The shadow treasurer Joe Hockey is under scrutiny today for telling ABC’s 7.30 last night that he heard “weeks ago” that Qantas was considering grounding its fleet.

He now says he can’t recall specifically who told him.

The Transport Minister Anthony Albanese says that’s unbelievable.

But the Government is also facing questions about whether it took seriously enough the warnings it received from Qantas.

From Canberra, Naomi Woodley reports.

NAOMI WOODLEY: The political debate over the Qantas industrial dispute is now firmly centred on who knew what and when.

Yesterday the Government challenged the Opposition Leader Tony Abbott to say if the Coalition had been given advance notice of the airline’s decision to ground its fleet. Mr Abbott says they weren’t and he only learnt of the move shortly before it was announced.

But now attention has shifted to the shadow treasurer Joe Hockey after this exchange with Leigh Sales on the ABC’s 7:30 program last night.

(Excerpt from 7:30)

LEIGH SALES: When did you first hear from Qantas whether it was considering the option of grounding its fleet or locking out staff, that it was considering that option?

JOE HOCKEY: Well it’s been saying it around Parliament House for the last few weeks.

LEIGH SALES: But I’m asking when you specifically…

JOE HOCKEY: Everyone in Parliament House knew.

Well, I specifically heard that they were going to undertake a lock out and a grounding at quarter to five on Saturday.

LEIGH SALES: But I’m asking when you first…

JOE HOCKEY: Which is three hours…

LEIGH SALES: ..heard that they were considering that option, that that was the sort of stuff that was on the table.

JOE HOCKEY: Oh, weeks ago. They’ve been saying that. Weeks ago – publicly and privately.

LEIGH SALES: In a meeting…

JOE HOCKEY: They have been saying for weeks.

LEIGH SALES: And did you hear that in a meeting with Qantas representatives…

JOE HOCKEY: No, no – look, Leigh, they have been saying it privately and publicly around Parliament House for weeks.

LEIGH SALES: But I’d just like to know specifically when you actually heard that. I don’t want you to say generally.

JOE HOCKEY: Well, I can’t- I can’t recall. I can’t recall.

LEIGH SALES: But you would have heard it personally in a meeting from a Qantas representative at some time in the past few weeks that that was an option?

JOE HOCKEY: Yeah, sure, as did others. Qantas have been in this building for weeks.

(End of excerpt)

NAOMI WOODLEY: The Government’s response, spearheaded by the Transport Minister Anthony Albanese, has been predictable.

ANTHONY ALBANESE: So, you’re the shadow treasurer of the nation. You get told that Qantas is planning to lock out its entire workforce – including workers who have nothing to do with any dispute – and as a result, lock out its customers from taking their planes to their destination, and you can’t recall when you were told.

JOE HOCKEY: It is not the Opposition that is running the country. It is the Government. Mr Albanese is trying to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear here.

NAOMI WOODLEY: On ABC News 24 this morning Mr Hockey was asked what he meant by his answers last night.

JOE HOCKEY: Let me be very clear about this. Qantas for an extended period of time have been warning everyone around the building – and indeed doing it publicly – that if industrial action deteriorated they would need to ground their fleet- they may ground their fleet. That’s what they effectively said – they may need to ground their fleet.

NAOMI WOODLEY: He’s reiterated that the Coalition was only told about the grounding and lock out of workers about 15 minutes before it was announced on Saturday afternoon.

JOE HOCKEY: And Qantas had not suggested that there was going to be a lock out any previous time to that. The Government found out at 2 o’clock on Saturday that there was going to be both a grounding and a lockout and they did nothing about it in those three hours.

NAOMI WOODLEY: The Government is facing its own questions over whether it should have known Qantas was going to ground its planes.

The Qantas CEO Alan Joyce says over the past few months the airline had made it very clear to government ministers that it could ground the entire airline, that it was a real possibility, and that it could happen at very short notice with immediate effects.

Anthony Albanese says he took a different message from his discussions with Qantas.

ANTHONY ALBANESE: The airline had been talking very clearly and publicly about if the engineers’ in particular industrial action continued then there would be a series of groundings. It is correct to say that if you continued to ground aircraft over a period of time it would reach a point whereby the airline would make a decision because of the proportion of the fleet that was grounded that it was time to ground the entire fleet. That was a logical extension of that.

At no stage did Qantas indicate that that position was imminent.

NAOMI WOODLEY: Speaking on AM the Finance Minister Penny Wong also sought to clarify.

(Excerpt from AM)

PENNY WONG: Mr Albanese’s made very clear it is the case that there was grounding of planes – I think he said some seven planes – as a result of engineer industrial action.

That is a very different thing to locking out the entire workforce. The equivalent on the side of the worker would be everybody working for Qantas saying, we’re not going in today.

And if that had occurred, the Government would have been equally critical of the people engaged in that kind of extreme industrial action.

SABRA LANE: So you’re saying that this is a lie, that Qantas is rewriting history?

PENNY WONG: I’m saying that it’s very important that when people talk about grounding, they are clear about the distinction between grounding as a result of engineer industrial action and grounding as a result of an employer making a unilateral decision to lock out its entire workforce and ground the entire fleet.

(End of excerpt)

NAOMI WOODLEY: The Government maintains that it was not told prior to Saturday that Qantas was contemplating a complete grounding and lock out of its workforce.

ELEANOR HALL: Naomi Woodley reporting.